Posted by Paul O'Dell - Lancaster Fine Flooring on February 17, 19100 at 09:37:09:
In Reply to: Re: vinyl peaking at underlay joints posted by Paul O'Dell - Lancaster Fine Flooring on February 17, 19100 at 09:30:38:
: : I've installed vinyl for 22 years and recently got a complaint about joints showing in the luan. I know your not supposed to use luan and its a pain to have to inspect and cull through it but that is all the stores will provide because of cost. Anyway when I went to replace this job I was shocked to see the vinyl peaking directly on top of every luan joint both side and end joints. It was if the luan had expanded in all directions and the resulting excess vinyl just gathered up at the joints. It was in a new home over OSB and crawl space but I have done many like it and this was the first time it happened. Have anyone seen this happen before?
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: Dear John,
: Yes, luan 1/4" sub-floor is about ALL any contractors we do work for will utilize because of its cost effectiveness from their plywood/OSB suppliers. You are correct in assuming that your plywool "stretched" or "warped". THat is what it does as well as delamination when the adhesive has been spread. I think it sucks up all the moisture from the adhesive. I have even had Luan delaminate from the moisture from my Ardex patch at the seams !!!!
: When I install Luan (and I only install it if a specific customer demands it or installs it on their own), I get a written release of sub-floor guarantee and I make damn sure to include a universal release of guarantee because you know that no matter what happens to the floor they will blame it on the installer. And if they dont want to sign it, then let it be someone elses headache. Also, when I do utilize Luan, I make sure to ALWAYS allow a utility-knife-width of spacing in between each and every joint in the boards, and allow a few days for the wood to "cure" (for loss of a better word). Of course I always "push" my multi-ply, but contractors think they know more than us flooring professionals (hahahaha) and they have huge egos', so there will be a time when they will want to utilize the PROPPER sub-floor, but that time is not today, and it will not come until us floor-men band together and tell them HECK NO WE WONT USE IT AND IF YOU DO USE IT, WE WONT GUARANTEE IT. !!!!!! When that day comes the contractors will have to foot the bill for reinstalls, NOT US !!! Then they will get sick of the problems and use proper materials. And that wont happen anytime soon, because there are 10,000 floor men who have used it all their lives and love it because it's cheap and it works for them. Heck its our own fault.
: If you installed over builder-installed sub-floor, I would simply tell them that your guarantee is not in effect because they utilixed the wrong materials. Depending on YOUR contract with them, this will work. Have you ever told them it was ok to use it ? Have you supported this method before ? Have you created this problem by continually using their products and NOT letting them know that their could be potential problem with it ?
: One thing you could do is to send them a notarized letter through your attorney and say that any utilization of improper/unsupported sub-floors (on their part) will no longer be guaranteed by your company. A VINYL FLOOR IS ONLY AS GOOD AS THE FLOOR COVERINGS, AND VINYL AND SUB-FLOOR ARE FLOOR COVERINGS ... NOT STRUCTURAL MATERIALS.
: Goog luck John ....
PS ---- If you are supplying and installing the Luan, why dont you just substitue Multi-ply or another "approved" subfloor ? For a few cents more per square foot, you could not have these problems.
Good luck